Chapter 15

Samuel tells Saul that it is time for Amalek to be punished for not helping Israel when they came up from Egypt.  Saul and his army are to kill everything Amalek has - man, woman, infant, and animals.  Everything is to die by the sword.  Everything and every one.  Here it is, harsh as it sounds:

3 Now go and strike Amalek and devote to destruction all that they have. Do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, child and infant, ox and sheep, camel and donkey.'" [1Sa 15:3 ESV]

2021 - This is one of those verses often used to judge a culture we don't understand, that lived under rules and requirements of which we are unaware, as being inferior to us in their cruelty and callousness.  We do that while allowing the murder of unborn children in their mother's wombs - the only "safe place" that they will ever know.  Who do we think we are???????

Now here is one for FB.

2023 - What we tend to forget, what we surely know but don't think about, is that a God who would command this kind of retribution against a whole nation because they dishonored God's people is the same God that will judge those who reject his Son.  Don't  think there's any such place as hell?  Don't think a loving God would send you there?  Better think again.  The God you are depending on for mercy has already shown that He is also about justice.  Note also that the Amalekites did not get to vote on whether the loving God of the Israelites would wipe out a whole nation for their actions.  God is not running a democracy.

MSB says the Amalekites were a wandering desert people descended from Esau.  They became a "marked people" when they attacked Israel as they left Egypt.  They lived in the Negev, which Israel has to pass through.  They attacked Israel as they left, and later were used by God to punish Israel - but their fate was sealed.  David had to fight against them also.  The final descendants of the Amalekites were destroyed in Hezekiah's day.  The final descendants of Agag, who was King in Saul's day, are finally dispatched during the time of Esther and Mordecai (473 BC, Est 2:5, 8-10) in Persia.

Saul conquers the Amalekites, but spares their King, Agag, and the best of all their livestock.  He kills the people and the children and the babies, but not the best animals.  He isn't sparing the animals out of compassion, but out of greed.  All they held to be worthless they destroyed.  This directly violated what God had commanded.  This is disobedience in its purest form.

That night, God tells Samuel that he regrets making Saul king, because Saul does not obey.  Samuel is angry about this (NASB translates this "distressed" instead of angry.  MSB note says it was because Samuel as priest was worried that the king was not following God.) 

Here is another aspect of Saul's character that I had not noticed before:

12 And Samuel rose early to meet Saul in the morning. And it was told Samuel, "Saul came to Carmel, and behold, he set up a monument for himself and turned and passed on and went down to Gilgal." [1Sa 15:12 ESV]

Saul set up a monument to himself, not to God.  He is self-promoting, arrogant, full of pride.  And because he sees himself as the "one", he feels no obligation to be meticulous in following God's commands.  He blatantly disobeys - because he is king..

Next day, Samuel confronts Saul:

13 And Samuel came to Saul, and Saul said to him, "Blessed be you to the LORD. I have performed the commandment of the LORD." 14 And Samuel said, "What then is this bleating of the sheep in my ears and the lowing of the oxen that I hear?" 15 Saul said, "They have brought them from the Amalekites, for the people spared the best of the sheep and of the oxen to sacrifice to the LORD your God, and the rest we have devoted to destruction." [1Sa 15:13-15 ESV]

Look closely at this.  Saul says he has done what God commanded, though Saul can hear live animals in the background proving that Saul did NOT do what God commanded.  I have seen people do this, and never understood it.  It is a lie.  It is wrong.  Yet someone, people like Saul see their actions as compliant.  In Saul's mind, he isn't lying.  He did do as God wanted him to do.  There is this disconnect between reality and perception in such people.  It is so profound that even when it is pointed out to them, they just still don't see themselves as in the wrong.  That's the key...these people NEVER judge themselves. 

We today do the same.  We claim to be obeying God's word, but the evidence makes it obvious that we are not.  Obvious!  This was not a judgement call by Samuel.  So Samuel calls him on it, and Saul says it is the people who spared, not him.  And the sacrifice will be to Samuel's God, to "your God", rather than "our God".  There are real problems here.

Here is another strategy - When Saul is confronted, he does not see himself in the wrong, but shifts the blame for what has happened to others.  He didn't round up the sheep and oxen to save them, it was others who did that.  He is the king.  He wants the credit for the good, but not the responsibility of obedience.  He wants to be popular with man, not with God

Possible FB Post.  There is so much here.  Would need to "untangle" it all before posting something.

17 And Samuel said, "Though you are little in your own eyes, are you not the head of the tribes of Israel?  The LORD anointed you king over Israel. 18 And the LORD sent you on a mission and said, 'Go, devote to destruction the sinners, the Amalekites, and fight against them until they are consumed.' [1Sa 15:17-18 ESV]

So here is a reason.  Saul is head and shoulders taller than any man in Israel, yet sees himself as a small man.  Saul just does not see himself as King, though that is where God put him.  As King, he could have insisted that the people destroy the animals, but he doesn't do so, because he has not, and refuses to, assume his role as leader, as King of all Israel.  And in his view:

20 And Saul said to Samuel, "I have obeyed the voice of the LORD. I have gone on the mission on which the LORD sent me. I have brought Agag the king of Amalek, and I have devoted the Amalekites to destruction. [1Sa 15:20 ESV]  For the second time, Saul insists that he has obeyed God.  With Samuel right in front of him telling him otherwise.

Because he is filtering God's commands through his self-imposed limitations, through his human abilities, he believes he has done all that he could have done.  He has done as much of what God commanded as it was in his power to do, as he was comfortable doing, and he believes that should count.  That should be enough.  He obeyed.  But he didn't feel qualified to require obedience of others to those commandments.  He did not depend on God to supply what he lacked.  No faith.

The lesson is that when God puts us into a role, whether we feel we can do it or not, we must depend on God to get us through it.  This is why God puts so many "unqualified" people in places of authority.  It is so they depend on Him to perform their role, not on themselves.  Noah was not a ship-builder.  Moses was a loner and a shepherd.  But they did it anyway!  Saul won't go beyond his human abilities.  So remember that if you feel fully qualified in the role that God has assigned to you, it is almost certain that you are mistaken about what God wants you to do, and are instead doing what you yourself want to do.

Good FB Post - but search.  It may have already been there.  I'm sure there was one very much like it.  And again, there is so much here.  This one would require some work.

2026 - I can't help but tie this to Chase Hughe's "Six Needs" in "Six-Minute X-ray".  Saul's need, and it was an overwhelming need, was for approval.  Here is what Hughes says about those who have that as their primary need:

Approval - Seek permission and recognition.  Ask to do things they don't need to ask about.  Self-deprecating statements - "I don't know if I can do that, I suck at that".  They want to be contradicted.  They are rigid, have imposter syndrome, feel strong if they are professionally successful, formal dress or dressed up a little, frequent competition, carry meds to give to others, don't make a fuss at restaurants, self-deprecating,

And their greatest fears are:

Approval/Recognition       Dismissal, disapproval, contempt, feeling left out

So Saul called the people up.  He was recognized as having the authority - the recognition - to be able to do that.  Verse 17 tells us that Saul was "small" in his own eyes - a great description of imposter syndrome.  He did not feel qualified for the position he was in.  Rather than turning to God for help, though, he continued to seek approval from those around him.  How?  By letting them keep their spoil instead of using his authority as King to have them dedicate it all to destruction.  He was afraid that if he did that, after asking them to risk their lives, he would lose their approval - and that scared him to the core, not because it happened, but because he feared it would happen, and did not depend on God to help him through it. 

This needs to go in my readings on Temper Tantrums.

2026 - And it continues.  Look here:

28 And Samuel said to him, "The LORD has torn the kingdom of Israel from you this day and has given it to a neighbor of yours, who is better than you. [1Sa 15:28 ESV]. 

Imagine the impact on someone who's core need is to be approved, when he hears that what is his is being taken away, because he no longer has the approval of the one gave him something, and that something is to be given to "someone better than you".  Disapproval of the most direct, most demeaning, most soul-crushing kind for a person with these internal needs.

No wonder Saul went insane.  He could never recover from this...and the whole kingdom knew it was so, and why it was so.  Insanity was his only escape.

Then comes one of my favorite verses in the whole Bible:

22 And Samuel said, "Has the LORD as great delight in burnt offerings and sacrifices, as in obeying the voice of the LORD? Behold, to obey is better than sacrifice, and to listen than the fat of rams. [1Sa 15:22 ESV]

Possible FB post, if phrased correctly.  In doing it to discharge an obligation so we can move on, we did it wrong.  If we attend church on Sunday and our Monday friends would be shocked to hear that we did, we're doing it wrong.  This one seems familiar too.  Have I already done this?

ALSO, vs 23 also needs to be considered because it is this verse that gives us the real reasons for God's rejection of Saul, that gives us the flaws in Saul that lead to his downfall.  They are rebellion - as bad as divination! - and presumption, as bad as idolatry in that we use our own views in place of God's, we make ourselves God.  These two together are rejection of God, and God in turn, in this case, rejects Saul right back.

2022 - This verse:

23 For rebellion is as the sin of divination, and presumption is as iniquity and idolatry. Because you have rejected the word of the LORD, he has also rejected you from being king." [1Sa 15:23 ESV]

I haven't really noticed this one before.  How are rebellion and divination so alike?  And presumption like idolatry?  We know the last in each set are hated by God.  MSB says it doesn't mean these sins are "the same", but that the sins of rebellion and, in the NASB, insubordination, are just as bad as divination and idolatry.  They are as hated by God as these other two sins.  Even if that is all that is implied here, it is quite interesting, given Dt 18:9-14.

2026 - I will disagree with MSB here, at least to an extent.

Rebellion IS AS divination.

Presumption IS AS iniquity and idolatry.

In both, the idea is that we put ourselves in the place of God.  God knows the future.  If he wanted us to know it also, he'd send us a prophet.  We try to usurp the awe owed to God by being AS God and knowing the future.  That is divination.

Presumption is also putting ourselves in God's place.  We are lifting ourselves up as judges, on the same level as God, when we "presume" to know HIS intended purpose in events.  Or we presume to know that this "substitution" for what he actually said will still be acceptable to  him.  It is idolatry in that we worship our own high standing as equal to the one true and living God.

And next, at least for a moment - or perhaps just because he knows it is what he should say - Saul repents:

24 Saul said to Samuel, "I have sinned, for I have transgressed the commandment of the LORD and your words, because I feared the people and obeyed their voice. [1Sa 15:24 ESV]

In 25, Saul says "ok, now that I've repented come along with me".  He wants to appear "pious" to the people and Samuel's attendance will send that message.  Vs 24 is a lie.  There is no repentance.  We know this from Samuel's reaction.  He refuses to accompany Saul.

2021 -

27 As Samuel turned to go away, Saul seized the skirt of his robe, and it tore. 28 And Samuel said to him, "The LORD has torn the kingdom of Israel from you this day and has given it to a neighbor of yours, who is better than you. [1Sa 15:27-28 ESV]

Is this where that whole "tearing of clothes" originates?  Have we ever seen that before?   Yes we have, and here are the first three of 7 times before this that people tore their clothes:

29 When Reuben returned to the pit and saw that Joseph was not in the pit, he tore his clothes ... 34 Then Jacob tore his garments and put sackcloth on his loins and mourned for his son many days. [Gen 37:29, 34 ESV]

13 Then they tore their clothes, and every man loaded his donkey, and they returned to the city. [Gen 44:13 ESV]

This verse, that I have never noticed before:

29 And also the Glory of Israel will not lie or have regret, for he is not a man, that he should have regret." [1Sa 15:29 ESV]

God is not a man.  The Mormon's are wrong.  No man can be a god.

Samuel finishes the job that Saul wouldn't:

33 And Samuel said, "As your sword has made women childless, so shall your mother be childless among women." And Samuel hacked Agag to pieces before the LORD in Gilgal. [1Sa 15:33 ESV]

From the text and the footnotes, it is possible that Agag thought he was in the clear.  As a captured enemy, he would have expected to be put to death, but apparently Saul's treatment of him had mitigated his fear.  Then Samuel hacks him to pieces.  Not a good day for Agag at all.  Once this is all over, this verse:

35 And Samuel did not see Saul again until the day of his death, but Samuel grieved over Saul. And the LORD regretted that he had made Saul king over Israel. [1Sa 15:35 ESV]

Both Samuel and God grieve about Saul's failings.  There is something here that says God appoints, but men must comply.  Something here that says part of God's perfect will requires the cooperation of his appointees.  Or maybe...what is being said is that though God's will is perfect, many times his appointees are there as examples of how frivolous and small and incapable of sinless living, of pride-free living, any man with power is.  Men just aren't capable of making the right decisions most of the time, just as the angels were not able to do so before man was created.

(((Saul is from Gibeah.  This is the town that got the Benjamites almost wiped completely out of Israel.  This is where the story much like the one about Sodom and Gomorrah takes place.  The woman is sent out, ends up dead, and is cut into twelve pieces and sent all over Israel.  All Israel makes war on the Benjamites.  This is in Judges 19-21.  Not sure why this note is here...maybe I thought Gibeah and Gilgal were the same place.  Looked it up and I don't think they are after all.  Nothing wrong with this note...just not sure why I thought it relevant at this spot.)))

(Looks like I really get "involved" in chapter 15 each time, run out of time, and push hurriedly through 16 and 17.  Next time, I need to temper that a bit.)

How are we to understand this contrast:

29 And also the Glory of Israel will not lie or have regret, for he is not a man, that he should have regret." [1Sa 15:29 ESV]  H5162. 

35 And Samuel did not see Saul again until the day of his death, but Samuel grieved over Saul. And the LORD regretted that he had made Saul king over Israel. [1Sa 15:35 ESV]  H5162, translated "repented" in KJV.

Six verses apart in the same chapter.  They say the opposite.  God does not regret.  The Lord regretted.  Same word in Strong's reference in both.