Revelation Chapter 6
The first five seals.
Vs 1 says "Now I watched...". John is still in heaven. We are still observing events from that vantage.
In this chapter, the narration of events continues. We saw in Chapter 5 that the Lamb received a scroll with seven seals from the one on the throne, from Theos. Now in Chapter 6, we see the seals broken open, one at a time. Remember that the scroll cannot be unrolled until all seven are broken. This may be important later, and we ought to especially note events following the breaking of the seventh seal. After all, it makes no sense to seal an empty scroll with seven seals. There has to be something written in there.
John MacArthur’s book, “Because the Time is Near”, says the seven seals parallel Jesus' chronology given in Matthew 24. This is a common position for those who believe the rapture comes before the Tribulation begins. I disagree that the seals parallel all of Matthew 24 as a general statement. I don't think Matthew 24 does exactly that.
There are portions of Matthew 24 that tie directly to Revelation 6 – places where the two chapters are firmly linked in describing the same events - and we will look closely at those verses. But Matthew 24 has other material also. There is no reason really for John to just repeat what Jesus has already said. John had read Matthew 24, and certainly had his own copy of it. So Revelation reveals additional details.
Next, my interpretation of the seal judgments is built on the belief that the Rapture occurs within the Sixth Seal. I also believe it can be established that the Rapture occurs right in the middle of the 70th week. I do not like the terms Trib and Great Trib because of the confusion the second one causes with Matthew 24:21 where Jesus uses the term “great tribulation” in a very different sense. However, as long as we understand The Tribulation and The Great Tribulation to be externally generated references to the first 3 ½ years of the 70th and the last 3 ½ years of the 70th, respectively, I am fine with using them.
((I intend to bring those notes back here, and establish what the overall time line looks like right here at the first.))
My "working theory" as I write this is that the key to understanding the book of Revelation is in the perspective from which described events are viewed. To this point, I have made a “big deal” of the fact that John is in heaven, and he is seeing what things look like from “up there”. He will be standing in heaven as the seals are opened, and he will be observing what happens IN HEAVEN as each seal is opened. He sometimes elaborates a bit on how these heavenly events will affect the earth – and I will speculate on that at length – but we must always keep in mind the perspective of the writer.
To restate, the seven seals described in Revelations 6 are what events looked like to John as viewed from heaven. There will be other events that are viewed from earth. For example, the “differences” noted between Matthew 24, where Jesus tells his followers on earth what to expect there, and Revelation 6 where John sees events that occur in heaven during the same time period, can be explained by the different “viewpoints” of the descriptions. So in this case, we have the same events described first from one point of view and then from the other. We will keep a close watch for such shifts in perspective.
And one last preparatory note…In BTN (Because the Time is Near), MacArthur says that the first four seals occur during the first half of the 70th week, the fifth seal is a transitioning from first half to last, and the sixth and the seventh seal - in fact the rest of Revelation - occur in the second half of the 70th week. I agree on the first four, but I put the fifth firmly in the first half also, along with SOME of the sixth. The latter part of the sixth and the seventh I would put in the last half. With that established, here we go…
THE FIRST SEAL – Rev 6:1,2
1 Now I watched when the Lamb opened one of the seven seals, and I heard one of the four living creatures say with a voice like thunder, "Come!" 2 And I looked, and behold, a white horse! And its rider had a bow, and a crown was given to him, and he came out conquering, and to conquer. [Rev 6:1-2 ESV]
Jesus, as the Lamb, opens the first seal. The scroll with the seals was handed to Jesus by the Father, but Jesus is the one unleashing these things as judgment on the earth. Remember that the earth is as it was in the days of Noah. There are very few "good people" left on the entire planet.
We often hear this First Seal described as a rider with a bow but no arrows. This is done in order to identify the rider as the one we call the Antichrist. (I do not like that name, and believe it is misapplied. So for the remainder of this document, I will refer to the “Antichrist” as the Man of Lawlessness (MoL), or the Son of Perdition (SoP)). Why this interpretation? Because of these verses in Daniel: 23 And at the latter end of their kingdom, when the transgressors have reached their limit, a king of bold face, one who understands riddles, shall arise. 24 His power shall be great--but not by his own power; and he shall cause fearful destruction and shall succeed in what he does, and destroy mighty men and the people who are the saints. [Dan 8:23-24 ESV]. The phrase “not by his own power” is interpreted by many to mean he does not rise through war but by cunning and intrigue. Therefore, since the rider on the white horse has no sword, but only a bow without any arrows, he must conquer without war.
Here is the first place where it is important to remember that John is describing the heavenly view of this horse and rider. I think what we have here in the four horsemen we are about to see are angels, empowered to carry out the "harm" bound up in each of the seven seals. I get this from Rev 7:2: 2 Then I saw another angel ascending from the rising of the sun, with the seal of the living God, and he called with a loud voice to the four angels who had been given power to harm earth and sea, [Rev 7:2 ESV]. And we know this reference to “the four angels” is based on this verse: 8 …And they were given authority over a fourth of the earth, to kill with sword and with famine and with pestilence and by wild beasts of the earth. [Rev 6:8 ESV]. This verse comes after the introduction of the fourth horse and rider. This sequence makes it very clear that the riders are all angels, empowered to harm the earth. This rider on a white horse is therefore the first of the four angels, sent from heaven, where John is observing. This is NOT the MoL himself coming down from heaven. The MoL is a man, and earth is his origin. The horse and rider are real – a real angel on a real horse, and they are sent from heaven to initiate and execute God’s will on earth. Now that we know who this angel is, let’s look at what he does.
This first rider is about conquering and to conquer. I do not think this angel is personally going to start up battles with earthly governments, kings, presidents and such. I think his power will be to "push" world governments toward war with each other. Think of this angel as the “spirit” of war as a solution to national problems. Perhaps he will create a worldwide mindset that embraces a sort of latter day imperialism? Perhaps acquiring diminishing resources in the name of “clear and present danger to our nation” will become an acceptable justification to make war on the neighbors? This rider will somehow plant the irresistible idea of conquest in the minds of those ruling on earth. On earth, what we will see is that wars start to kick off everywhere as governments try to gather the resources that they need to stay in power, to feed their people, to secure energy supplies. This will destabilize the world, and is the first step in creating a situation so chaotic that the promises of stability and peace - yet to be made by the MoL - will be irresistible, and he will be rushed into power.
The rider of the first horse is given a crown. It does not say that he wears it. Could be he is given the crown so that he can “award” it to whomever he wills. It might also be that the crown tells us that the wars that begin to break out on earth will be wars of conquest, where the winner rules over the losers. We haven’t seen war like that in a long time. And it might be that the angel is taking this crown to the MoL, as head of all nations. This would show that the power of the MoL is awarded to him from heaven. He is therefore a part of heaven’s plan for the end. We cannot be positive about this, but we do know that Kings wear crowns, and that this crown comes from heaven itself. We also know that none of the other riders are given a crown. This interpretation makes sense if we think about the kind of circumstances which might prompt the whole world to unite under one ruler. Perhaps these first four seals kind of “set the scene” for the entrance of the MoL as a false “savior” of the planet?
THE SECOND SEAL – Rev: 6:3,4.
3 When he opened the second seal, I heard the second living creature say, "Come!" 4 And out came another horse, bright red. Its rider was permitted to take peace from the earth, so that people should slay one another, and he was given a great sword. [Rev 6:3-4 ESV]
The rider in the Second Seal will turn "man against his brother". It is tempting to link this to the wars of the white horse rider. However, it could also be about a worldwide breakdown of law and order such that neighbors kill neighbors, or maybe cities have internal rebellions. Think race riots, class riots, environmentalists vs fossil fuel enthusiasts. Think black vs white, gay vs straight and even male vs female. Almost anything could cause bloodshed. We're seeing some of that sort of thing now...just imagine these things amplified by the actions of an angel sent to earth for that specific purpose. I think the best interpretation is a breakdown of law and order. Perhaps this will all be aggravated by shortages resulting from the wars, which require ever increasing resources confiscated from the public. Imagine the kind of situation preppers are always talking about where it is “every man for himself and the rest of you can starve” kind of a situation. Think of a situation where 911 doesn’t work, where there is no law enforcement of any kind, no rescue. A world where the strongest and the best-armed are the ones in charge. Complete lawlessness.
(2024 random - Perhaps the instability will be caused worldwide by the rising militancy of the followers of Allah. We are starting to see that more and more. With them comes increasing violence in all kinds of areas, far beyond what they themselves are doing. But they are "tearing down" law enforcement to the point where lawlessness is growing less and less controlled. In the Scandinavian countries it was about rampant sex crimes, and then about gangs taking over public spaces such that the law abiding natives were/are afraid to leave their own homes. It's a siege mentality without an organized besieger. And now look what is happening in GB (this is in August 2024). Perhaps the only reason we are not seeing these riots in the US is because the invaders here are not Muslims so much as they are Catholics. Even so, I don't think it can be argued that violence is spreading worldwide. Yes, it may be that it has just moved into countries with better reporting, a freer press, and so on, so we are aware of it...But even looked at that way, the violence is spreading from its source into areas where it was previously quashed immediately. Yet now, it thrives, and is even protected by the authorities in those areas.)
THIRD SEAL – Rev. 6:5-6:
5 When he opened the third seal, I heard the third living creature say, "Come!" And I looked, and behold, a black horse! And its rider had a pair of scales in his hand. 6 And I heard what seemed to be a voice in the midst of the four living creatures, saying, "A quart of wheat for a denarius, and three quarts of barley for a denarius, and do not harm the oil and wine!" [Rev 6:5-6 ESV]
In the Third Seal we see starvation and shortages following the worldwide conflicts and the breakdown of law and order. A day’s wages will feed one grown man for one day. If he has a family, he will need to buy barley - not nearly as nutritious but more volume - just so his wife and children will have some kind of food, so they can put something in their stomachs. The lower wages imply that widespread wars and the breakdown of the rule of law have undone supply lines. Economies have shrunk to local size. There is no more interstate commerce much less global commerce. So the diminished scale of the economy also diminishes the amount of labor needed, and more workers than work result in subsistence wages for all. However, the oil and wine are still intact. Think of these as luxuries, which will still be available to the very rich and/or to the well-connected. Naturally, this kind of inequity will fuel anger that will result in still more violence, anger, and rage in a time when there is very little law and order. Civilization as we know it will continue to fall apart.
2024 - Think of the disruptions in shipping through the Suez Canal over the last year, since the Hamas violence against Israel? The Houthis have attacked over 100 ships in the last year, making many - I should say most - ships go around Africa. World supply chains are disrupted. The Panama Canal is/was already having trouble because the water levels are down and the really big ships cannot get through there. They have to go around South America. This is driving up prices worldwide, and creating shortages worldwide because the shipping cannot supply what is demanded at a fast enough pace. And...it is probably not at all coincidental that Israel is striking out at her neighbors all around - all of whom are Muslims of one kind or another.
FOURTH SEAL – Rev 6:7-8:
7 When he opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth living creature say, "Come!" 8 And I looked, and behold, a pale horse! And its rider's name was Death, and Hades followed him. And they were given authority over a fourth of the earth, to kill with sword and with famine and with pestilence and by wild beasts of the earth. [Rev 6:7-8 ESV]
The Fourth Seal releases a rider on a pale horse. We have previously seen this Angel of Death in the Old Testament. He was seen in Egypt, and again in Judah during David's reign. Once the Death Angel passes, Hades will have a lot of new faces. Power is given to these four - not just to Death and Hades - to kill 25% of the earth with sword, hunger, pestilence and wild beasts. The cumulative results of war, conflict and starvation will ultimately reduce the world's population by a fourth.
What is the significance of “sword, famine, pestilence, and wild beasts”? Turns out these four things have shown up before, in the Old Testament. Here are the verses:
17 I will send famine and wild beasts against you, and they will rob you of your children. Pestilence and blood shall pass through you, and I will bring the sword upon you. I am the LORD; I have spoken." [Eze 5:17 ESV]
21 "For thus says the Lord GOD: How much more when I send upon Jerusalem my four disastrous acts of judgment, sword, famine, wild beasts, and pestilence, to cut off from it man and beast! [Eze 14:21 ESV]
27 Say this to them, Thus says the Lord GOD: As I live, surely those who are in the waste places shall fall by the sword, and whoever is in the open field I will give to the beasts to be devoured, and those who are in strongholds and in caves shall die by pestilence. [Eze 33:27 ESV].
The verses in Ezekiel are talking about the imminent fall of Jerusalem. Here was the pronouncement from God, a little earlier in Ezekiel 5: 7 Therefore thus says the Lord GOD: Because you are more turbulent than the nations that are all around you, and have not walked in my statutes or obeyed my rules, and have not even acted according to the rules of the nations that are all around you, 8 therefore thus says the Lord GOD: Behold, I, even I, am against you. And I will execute judgments in your midst in the sight of the nations. [Eze 5:7-8 ESV]. We see that in Ezekiel, God is just done with them. And then in 5:17 and the other verses above, we see that these events take place, they are SENT, after God has run out of patience, after all possibility of repentance has passed, and wrath must come. So these same four things God sent in Ezekiel as signs that His patience had run out will be seen again at the end of the age preliminary to the unleashing of God’s wrath against the whole world. This is what the first four seals are all about.
2024 - It is interesting that the first four seals are all about what happens on the earth, and that each is mentioned by a different "living creature", of which there were only four. One for each of the cardinal directions. The whole earth is recipient of the effects of these seals. Remember the same four in Ezekiel who's purpose was to go from the throne to the earth, carrying out God's own commands. These are the same four I think.
Let’s step aside for a moment, out of the chronology of Revelation 6 and think about the bigger picture here. We see that previously God has used these four acts as the beginning of unavoidable judgment. We see in Revelation that they mean the very same thing. What if these first four seals are in fact the final preliminaries to the 70th week of Daniel? What if they are not actually "in" the week? What would be the implications of that? Well first, that would mean that the first four seals are not part of the tribulation period. It would make them preliminary, but irreversible. Second, if you are convinced that the rapture happens before the tribulation, then a case – a very good case – can be made that the first four seals, at least, occur BEFORE the rapture AND before the tribulation. If we reckon things that way, we could accurately say that the church will go through at least the first four seals but still not be here for The Tribulation.
2024 - And third, if they are not a part of the 70th week, they are not limited to all occur in a 7 year period. They may build up over several decades, and culminate at the beginning of the 70th week. Unfortunately, this seems to make pretty good sense.
Remember that this whole tribulation/great tribulation designation is man-made. There is nothing in the Bible that labels the first half of the seventieth week “Tribulation”, and then the last half of that week “Great Tribulation”. We will see that the only place in the New Testament that the term “great tribulation” is even used is in Matthew 24:21, where events that occur BEFORE the rapture are in view. I offer this “redefinition” as a possible reconciliation of the Pre-Trib and Mid-Trib rapture positions. I am saying they may BOTH be correct, if we get our terms defined correctly. We ought to keep this possibility in mind as we continue.
(2024 - Actually, in the ESV, the term "great tribulation" appears three times, as follows:
21 For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been from the beginning of the world until now, no, and never will be. [Mat 24:21 ESV]
22 Behold, I will throw her onto a sickbed, and those who commit adultery with her I will throw into great tribulation, unless they repent of her works, [Rev 2:22 ESV]. This is about Thyatira, and the woman "Jezebel" that they tolerate there.
14 I said to him, "Sir, you know." And he said to me, "These are the ones coming out of the great tribulation. They have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. [Rev 7:14 ESV]. This one is about the martyrs...if we can pin down who they are. (2025 - The definite article is in the text. THE Great Tribulation, not just Great Tribulation. A unique, specific time is in view here. A very good candidate for "when" would be the same GT that Jesus references in Matthew. And perhaps this is also connected to the survivors of the time of the MoL that we see near the throne in Rev 20:4. Same "great tribulation is in view in Chapter 20.)
Same three verses in NASB95. Same three in KJV. Not sure how I missed these other two before. )
We can also note that through these first four seals, there has been nothing that we might interpret as the appearance of the MoL. This is important because of two scriptures that we should probably mention at this point:
3 Let no one deceive you in any way. For that day will not come, unless the rebellion comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of destruction, [2Th 2:3 ESV]. In this very familiar and oft quoted passage Paul is telling the Thessalonians that the rapture WILL NOT OCCUR until the MoL is revealed. I interpret “revealed” to mean that the church will recognize him for who he is and for what his appearance means. Also this verse:
15 "So when you see the abomination of desolation spoken of by the prophet Daniel, standing in the holy place (let the reader understand), [Mat 24:15 ESV]. In this passage, from verses 15 to 28, Jesus describes for his inner circle the events that occur just before the rapture.
The point to be made here is that the MoL, the Antichrist famed in eschatological speculation for as long as we can remember, WILL BE, and in fact MUST BE on the scene BEFORE the rapture. And so far, through these first four seals, we have had no hint of his appearance, though we have speculated that the time is now ripe for his appearance. That is to say that based on the kinds of things happening on the whole earth, we can see that these first four seals have created the kind of economic and political instability that begs for “a deliverer” to arise. A “savior” even. So I think he will be revealed right along here. Also, remember the POV of the description of the seals - this is how it all looks from heaven. The “view” from earth has not yet been described.
At this point, I think we might as well admit that the revealing of the MoL is not described anywhere in the seals. We simply are not told exactly where he is recognized. Even so, we will see as we continue that we are given some very concrete timestamps that will allow us to say “this happens before the MoL is revealed”, or “this happens after the MoL is revealed”.
Now back to the Fourth Seal…
At this point, we have built a case that posits a world encompassed by wars in all quarters and ripe for consolidation under one government if that will bring relief from rampant death and destruction. The red horse of the Fourth Seal runs wild. Rule of law has broken down, agriculture is in ruins. The world economy as we know it has collapsed, and local regions are on their own. Wages have collapse and poverty has increased dramatically world-wide. The violence isn't just nation vs nation, but neighbor vs neighbor. There will be no peace or safety anywhere. People will become survivalists in such a time, when there is just not enough order to maintain supply lines or carry on normal business. It will be every man for himself. Food distribution will break down and what little food there is will be controlled by – owned by – the governments or whatever mob happens to be in power locally. Only the strong will eat. Most will go hungry. Because of all this violence, lack of law enforcement, and breakdown of food distribution, millions will die - violently, from war, from starvation, from disease, and - strangely to me - from wild animals.
As a result of this chaotic situation 25% of the world's population will die. If it all started today, we are talking about 2 billion dead bodies. Try to get your head around that number…these deaths will occur over a protracted period of time – and by inference the first four seals will last for an extended period. I think the angel in Rev. 7:2b is calling out to these four riders before they are done with their work. This implies that they are not yet finished with their work even after the sixth seal. They are still busy, and that angel in 7:2b asks them to hold up for a bit until he can get the 144,000 sealed and marked.
Note also that these first four seals - the four horsemen - are listed out in rapid order. John covers all four in a mere 8 verses. It seems to me that these four build on each other. The conqueror starts things off, and he is still at work when the red horse arrives and begins to break down law and order. The famine of the third seal then lays over – results from – the first two. They all build on each other and by the fourth, all are active together, amplifying and accelerating the breakdown of infrastructure.
Compare this to events in Germany after the First World War Conditions were so terrible that people would flock to anyone who promised better times, more security, more personal safety, and regular meals. As the first four seals progress conditions will be ripe for a "king" to emerge and be ruler of the whole world. Think of a political genius who maneuvers his way to the top of the hierarchy – not by winning battles and wars, but by intimidation and cruelty. That’s how Hitler did it, too. I believe that a world government will be organized into this chaos, and from that government, the MoL will emerge. Then and only then can the rapture take place.
(2024 Random - After WWI, in addition to the items above, there was also a sort of "national scapegoat" upon whom all the problems could be blamed. An always local, they live among us kind of scapegoat. That was then...perhaps during the seals, it will be a worldwide scapegoat. Those who believe in Christ - instead of Allah - might be the very convenient and obvious choice for a scapegoat in that time. They won't take the mark, they won't bow to the MoL...by their (our?) own choice we will be outsiders and our non-participation will make us a threat to the whole system, to the whole plan to restore order to the world. They will need to get rid of us...)
SUMMARY OF FIRST FOUR SEALS AS OF 2023 -
I think the idea that they come from heaven riding on these horses means the riders are angels sent to carry out the events sealed in each seal. We will see confirmation of this in Rev 7:2. I think it is important to remember that these events happen as the seals are broken, but in no sense has the book itself yet been opened. I don't think the seals are entirely consecutive. I think they will all have some or a lot of overlap. I think some seals are a consequence of previous seals. The POV is heaven. We see the angels sent out to do what the seals released. I do NOT think there will be a world ruler trying to assert power, or at least not until the very end of all this. I believe we will be having wars and rumors of wars, there will be areas of pestilence and starvation, I believe that order will break down so completely that wild animals are killing people - perhaps people out in the bush scavenging because they have no food to buy. I believe these first four seals are about a world going into turmoil, anarchy, want, and death, accelerating in both frequency and intensity. These are the final stages of labor. The contractions are right on top of one another. The world is looking for a "savior" to pull them out of this craziness. Who might that be?
2026 - The first four seals are announced by the four creatures surrounding the throne saying "Come and see". The first four seals have to do with events on earth. We see this pattern also in the trumpets where the first four are specific and usually catastrophic events on the earth. When they were named, the four creatures had the face of a lion, a calf, a man, and a flying eagle. The horses are white, red, black, and ashen...most translations call that last horse "pale", but a few also call it pale green. The seals unleash conquerors and conquering, peace removed, high prices for food, and the big four of punishment - sword, famine, pestilence and wild beasts.
2026 - I don't think the likenesses or the colors or the catastrophes of each seal are just listed in some coincidental order. I think there is meaning and understanding to be extracted from the order in which these things take place. But I cannot see it.
Fifth Seal – Rev. 6:9-11
9 When he opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the witness they had borne. 10 They cried out with a loud voice, "O Sovereign Lord, holy and true, how long before you will judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?" 11 Then they were each given a white robe and told to rest a little longer, until the number of their fellow servants and their brothers should be complete, who were to be killed as they themselves had been. [Rev 6:9-11 ESV]
The results of opening this seal are quite different than anything that has gone before. When this seal is opened we see the altar in heaven and the souls of those previously martyred under that altar. This whole scene is in heaven, and there seems to be no implication of events on earth OTHER THAN the assurance that more martyrs are coming.
This is the first time the word altar has been used in Revelation. It tells us that there is a Temple in heaven also – likely the temple after which the earthly temple of Israel was modeled – and it has an altar on which sacrifices are offered.
Why would the martyrs be UNDER the altar? The Greek word always means exactly that – under, on the bottom, that sort of thing. We know from the Old Testament that the altar had a sort of “grating” as it’s floor, and the ashes of the animals sacrificed could fall through that and so be more easily gathered and removed later. So the picture here in heaven seems to be that having sacrificed their lives for God, they are now under the altar – picture ashes – and confined there perhaps until the appropriate time for their release.
Now think about that. Martyrs hold to their faith in the face of death. IF the rapture has already occurred, and all the saved have been removed, then who is left to be martyred? You would have to say that some will be saved even during trib and great trib, and the verse says that God’s vengeance DOES NOT BEGIN until ALL who will be martyred have been martyred.
To take this position – that the rapture has already occurred at the Fifth Seal is to say that there will be no vengeance on behalf of the martyr’s until the very end of great tribulation – assuming that people can be saved right up until the second coming of Jesus at the end of great tribulation. Does that really make any sense? After all, don’t we all agree that the Jews are going to be coming home in vast numbers during Tribulation/Great Tribulation? Don’t we all believe their coming home equates to their salvation? Won’t they stand before the earthly throne of Christ at the beginning of the Millennial for judgment? And we KNOW that at this judgment some will go into the Millennial to rule and reign with Christ. The only other alternative to explain this verse is that there will be NO MORE MARTYRS during trib and great trib, even though some will be saved. That is saying that the MoL won’t be able to kill any of the faithful returning Jews during tgt? I submit that none of this will fly.
Now, think about it the other way. What if the rapture has not yet occurred at the Fifth Seal. The MoL has come to power in here somewhere, and he is pursuing Christians to put them to death. We have these verses from Matthew 24: 15 "So when you see the abomination of desolation spoken of by the prophet Daniel, standing in the holy place (let the reader understand), 16 then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains. ... 21 For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been from the beginning of the world until now, no, and never will be. 22 And if those days had not been cut short, no human being would be saved. But for the sake of the elect those days will be cut short. [Mat 24:15-16, 21-22 ESV]. Clearly, people will be dying during this period AFTER appearance of the MoL, and BEFORE the rapture. We can be VERY CERTAIN that the rapture has not occurred during the verses above because we know that it DOES occur in a later verse in Matthew 24, here: 31 And he will send out his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. [Mat 24:31 ESV].
To summarize this very important point, there are three possibilities, two for the post-rapture position and one for the pre-rapture position. Either God’s vengeance on behalf of the martyrs under the altar does not begin until the end of Great Tribulation, or there will be no martyr’s at all after the rapture, or third, the rapture has NOT OCCURRED YET at the Fifth Seal. The possibility we choose is a very critical decision here.
And there is yet one more related point. In response to their questions, the martyrs are given white robes…but not crowns. That is, these have as yet received no reward in heaven for their sacrifice. At the bema judgment, crowns will be awarded. The bema cannot take place until after the rapture. Therefore, the rapture cannot yet have occurred at the opening of the Fifth Seal...or these martyrs would already have their crowns.
Let’s move on to another important point, about just who these martyrs are, rather than about when they ask their question. We want to know whether these martyrs go all the way back to Abel or whether only church age martyrs are included. Note that they are told to wait for their fellow servants and brothers. We might count as significant that they are not told to wait for more prophets to join them – prophet being the usual term for OT martyrs. While not a strong point, I think brothers and fellow servants imply others from the church age. I would also note that these others will be killed as they have been. NT martyrs are killed for the name of Christ, because the world hates them as it hated him. Old Testament martyrs were more often about serving God rather than some false god or idol, not just for belief. Again, not a strong point, but “another” point.
I think these martyrs are all martyrs of the church age. I do not think they are OT martyrs. The church is handled differently and the church age must end before God turns back to deal with his chosen people. The church age is sort of “inserted” in history. The OT prophets didn’t see it or recognize its significance. In simplest terms, the church age runs from Pentecost to the rapture. Interpreted this way, the martyrs of the Fifth Seal are told to wait until those in the church who are to die before the rapture have finished their work. This puts a definite period to how long the martyrs in heaven must wait. The church age martyrs still to die are those from the great tribulation that runs from Matthew 24:15-31, from the Abomination of Desolation to the gathering of the elect. The spiritual kingdom on earth established by the New Covenant must be completed, and then the physical promises to Israel will begin to play out. AFTER all those from the New Covenant are raptured out.
Many of the pre-trib rapture position tie this Fifth Seal to Matt 24:9, which says 9 "Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and put you to death, and you will be hated by all nations for my name's sake. [Mat 24:9 ESV]. The truth is that periods of great persecution have occurred many times in history. It most certainly happened in Nero's time, just prior to 70 AD, and for years after. And it also happened in Russia during the pogroms and in Germany during WW2. I can agree that each of these persecutions was as bad – if not worse – than what came before. We should at least consider that the verses in Matt 24, at least through vs 9, are ABOUT 70 AD, and not the end times. They sure seem to me to fit better if that is what they mean.
I disagree that the Fifth Seal ties to Matt 24:9. Instead I think it is tied here, in verses we have seen before: 15 "So when you see the abomination of desolation spoken of by the prophet Daniel, standing in the holy place (let the reader understand), 16 then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains. ... 21 For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been from the beginning of the world until now, no, and never will be. [Mat 24:15-16, 21 ESV]. Here, Jesus is telling his disciples that THEY WILL SEE the abomination of desolation and recognize it for who and what it is, and that when they do, they need to run for the hills. Why? Because they are going to be aggressively, wildly, brutally pursued and put to death – martyred – because they follow Christ. It is this time of persecution that Jesus labels “great tribulation”, and it is this passage that I think ties chronologically to the Fifth Seal.
Given these items, what can we imply about events on earth during the Fifth Seal? I think the scene in heaven tells us that very possibly the world’s anger about the devastated condition of the planet and about all the dead people – something like two billion people if it was today - will be taken out on professing Christians in a big way leading to still more martyrs. Since this is pre-rapture, these martyrs are part of the church. We can see the church being scapegoated as responsible for all this turmoil. It is a tried and true method, Nero was perhaps the first to scapegoat the church and it was very successful in getting the anger of the populace redirected.
If we have interpreted this part correctly, we ought to note also that the rapture marks the end of the church age. Therefore, since these martyrs that we see at the fifth seal are told to wait for their numbers to be complete, we have yet another basis for saying that the rapture has NOT occurred at the fifth seal.
SUMMARY OF FIFTH SEAL –
As the world falls apart, scapegoats will be needed. Rage will turn to blame, and those blamed will be killed. The church will be that scapegoat, and many will be killed by random mobs, by those who manage to seize a little authority by force. There won't be any justice – lynching is always a local affair. These will be summary executions, and these will be drawn out torture. This is what will be happening on earth as the fifth seal is opened. We are surmising these things based on the events we are seeing in heaven in Revelation, and we are doing our surmising based on correlative scripture from Matthew 24.
SIXTH SEAL – Rev. 6:12-17
12 When he opened the sixth seal, I looked, and behold, there was a great earthquake, and the sun became black as sackcloth, the full moon became like blood, 13 and the stars of the sky fell to the earth as the fig tree sheds its winter fruit when shaken by a gale. 14 The sky vanished like a scroll that is being rolled up, and every mountain and island was removed from its place. 15 Then the kings of the earth and the great ones and the generals and the rich and the powerful, and everyone, slave and free, hid themselves in the caves and among the rocks of the mountains, 16 calling to the mountains and rocks, "Fall on us and hide us from the face of him who is seated on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb, 17 for the great day of their wrath has come, and who can stand?" [Rev 6:12-17 ESV]
Now we come to a very busy seal, the sixth. A lot of things are going to happen here, and so we will need to take the time to fully establish as many details as we can. The description of Sixth Seal events runs for six verses. The first four seals got two verses each, the fifth seal got three, and now we have six.
I think we can make a lot of progress towards understanding verses 12-14, above, by comparing them to this verse from Matthew: 29 "Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light, and the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. [Mat 24:29 ESV].
What do these two verses have in common? Changes in the sun and moon and stars falling from heaven. I submit that these events do not happen often, even in the Bible. I believe that Revelation 6:12-14 and Matthew 24:29 are describing the same moment in time. We need to keep that in mind, because we will be using this moment as an anchor point in time to help us understand where we are in the unfolding events of the last days. The way we look at those events, and the time we assign to the rapture, in fact depend on whether we believe these two passages are describing the same “day”.
We should also note what does not tie together in these two passages. Revelation has an earthquake, Matthew does not. Revelation also has the sky “vanishing” and Matthew does not…unless “the powers of the heavens will be shaken” is about that. The Greek word that the ESV translates “vanishing” is only translated that way by the ESV and RSV. There are some other translations also. One is “split apart”, another is “rolled up” and still another is “receded”. The BLB definitions section says this Greek word, “apochorizo”, is “to separate, sever”, or “to part asunder”. I only add this because I think the word “vanish” is a poor choice for what this event will actually look like. Later, we will propose a fitting interpretation of this event, and place it precisely in the chronology of the end times.
I believe Rev 6:12-14 and Matt 24:29 are describing the same day and this is how I will use this anchor point to understand where we are. First, we know that the first five seals came before the signs in the sixth. I don’t think anyone would argue that point. All that means is that Revelation 6 is chronological in presentation. Since the first five seals came before these signs in heaven in Revelation 6, and since Matt 24:29 describes the same signs in heaven, then I think we can safely say that whatever comes before Matt 24:29 ALSO CAME BEFORE these signs. The implications of this are therefore that whatever came before Matt 24:29 must necessarily have come DURING or BEFORE the first five seals, and whatever comes after Matt 24:29 comes DURING or AFTER the Sixth Seal. It cannot be otherwise. Understanding this anchor point is critical. In my opinion, it is also very difficult to argue that this correlation is incorrect.
Now let’s compare the information in each passage and see what we might learn. In order to do this, we need to remember that the passage in Revelation describes events as seen by John, who is in heaven at the time. In Matthew 24, Jesus is telling his disciples on earth what they can expect to see on earth. So the perspectives – the points of view – are different, but the events are concurrent. Here are the two passages, shown together for easy comparison:
12 When he opened the sixth seal, I looked, and behold, there was a great earthquake, and the sun became black as sackcloth, the full moon became like blood, 13 and the stars of the sky fell to the earth as the fig tree sheds its winter fruit when shaken by a gale. 14 The sky vanished like a scroll that is being rolled up, and every mountain and island was removed from its place. [Rev 6:12-14 ESV]
29 "Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light, and the stars will fall from heaven and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. [Mat 24:29 ESV]
First, note the “when” of each passage. In Revelation, the signs occur as a result of the opening of the Sixth Seal. John sees a full moon become like blood. Full moons don’t last very long, so does this tell us to be more alert for these signs in the heavens if the moon is near full? Maybe…unless the moon always looks full when you are looking down from heaven. Stars will fall to earth? Many point to this as an indication that the whole scene is vision because we now know that real stars are far too massive to fall to earth. Here are three other references to stars found in Revelation:
20 As for the mystery of the seven stars that you saw in my right hand, and the seven golden lampstands, the seven stars are the angels of the seven churches, and the seven lampstands are the seven churches. [Rev 1:20 ESV]
1 And the fifth angel blew his trumpet, and I saw a star fallen from heaven to earth, and he was given the key to the shaft of the bottomless pit. [Rev 9:1 ESV]
4 His tail swept down a third of the stars of heaven and cast them to the earth. And the dragon stood before the woman who was about to give birth, so that when she bore her child he might devour it. [Rev 12:4 ESV]
I think we can make a good case here that these stars falling to earth are angels expelled from heaven at this time, or perhaps they are angels that will be needed on earth to minister to God’s people during this time. If one or both of these are true, angels being thrown out of heaven could certainly describe “shaking the powers of the heavens” if we also see these powers as angels residing in heaven. I am not sure what an angel falling from heaven to earth looks like, but I think we have two references here to tell us they look a lot like meteorites.
2024 - Note that whatever this is about, it has the same appearance whether you are standing in heaven watching it happen, as John is, or you are on earth watching it happen, as in Matthew 24. If it is literally stars, then they look the same despite perspective. If they are angels, they too look the same from either place. And how long have we called literal meteors "falling stars"?
2025 Addendum - This verse I found today while studying SysTheo 19: 6 On what were its bases sunk, or who laid its cornerstone, 7 when the morning stars sang together and all the sons of God shouted for joy? [Job 38:6-7 ESV]. Stars don't sing...unless they are angels.
In Revelation, we also have an earthquake and a vanishing sky. From John’s vantage in heaven, that earthquake was visible, but it does not say the earthquake was worldwide. If not worldwide, then Jesus might not mention it in Matthew, because many won’t know about it. The vanishing sky is also seen from heaven. Think of this as a window opening through which one can see clearly from heaven the events on earth.
Moving on to the last few verses in Revelation 6, we get this:
15 Then the kings of the earth and the great ones and the generals and the rich and the powerful, and everyone, slave and free, hid themselves in the caves and among the rocks of the mountains, 16 calling to the mountains and rocks, "Fall on us and hide us from the face of him who is seated on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb, 17 for the great day of their wrath has come, and who can stand?" [Rev 6:15-17 ESV]
((2024 - In my recent reading I also found this verse: 8 The high places of Aven, the sin of Israel, shall be destroyed. Thorn and thistle shall grow up on their altars, and they shall say to the mountains, "Cover us," and to the hills, "Fall on us." [Hos 10:8 ESV]. Is this a previous instance of people recognizing that the events around them are not "normal", but sent by God for his own reasons? And in Revelation we see the very same reaction to the events of those days? It is pretty clear in the Hosea verse that the call to "fall on us" had to do with Israel's fall, not the rest of the world. Even so, the reaction, and the understanding of those who experience such events, is the same.]))
We see here that everyone on earth, from Kings to slaves, now recognizes that these events are sent and controlled, by God. They recognize that the day of reckoning is at hand. Rather than fall on their knees and beg for one last chance at forgiveness, they go and hide. They seek out desolate, remote places, and the protection of rocks and mountains – they surround themselves with bedrock – thinking it may give them some protection from what is to come. These recognize that the wrath of God is about to begin.
It turns out that this term – wrath has come – has a very specific meaning. Here are some New Testament verses that use the term as I think it is meant in verse 17:
7 But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to his baptism, he said to them, "You brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the wrath to come? [Mat 3:7 ESV]
5 But because of your hard and impenitent heart you are storing up wrath for yourself on the day of wrath when God's righteous judgment will be revealed. [Rom 2:5 ESV]
9 Since, therefore, we have now been justified by his blood, much more shall we be saved by him from the wrath of God. [Rom 5:9 ESV]
10 and to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, Jesus who delivers us from the wrath to come. [1Th 1:10 ESV]
9 For God has not destined us for wrath, but to obtain salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ, [1Th 5:9 ESV]
From these verses we learn that in Jesus’ time, this “day of wrath” was in the future. It had not yet come. We see that at some point the wrath will be revealed. We see in Rev 6:17 that the day had come. But those who are saved by the blood of Christ will be SAVED FROM WRATH. I think we should interpret this as meaning we will be REMOVED from the pouring out of the wrath of Father and Son by the rapture. The last three verses above all speak to this. Those who are in Christ are to be saved from wrath.
One more point needs to be made as to the timeline of end time’s events. Wrath BEGINS somewhere in or after the Sixth Seal is opened. Based on the verses above, the church will be removed before wrath begins. So we know that BEFORE wrath begins, the rapture must take place. Maybe years before, maybe 1 second before, but we are promised that we will be gone before “the day of wrath” begins. Repeatedly promised this. The fact that it is stated so many times ought to be a clue that this is an important marker.
So that is what happens in Revelation AFTER the signs in heaven. What happens in Matthew after this? We get these two very important, very discernible verses:
30 Then will appear in heaven the sign of the Son of Man, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31 And he will send out his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. [Mat 24:30-31 ESV].
In Revelation, we see the lost running to hide as they realize that the end has arrived. In Matthew, Jesus tells his disciples what will happen to the saved on earth. Jesus is talking about this time from the vantage point of the earth.
The sign of the Son of Man will appear, causing man to mourn – which correlates very well to the effect the Sixth Seal has on mankind. What is this sign? Perhaps this:
64 Jesus said to him, "…from now on you will see the Son of Man seated at the right hand of Power and coming on the clouds of heaven." [Mat 26:64 ESV]. Maybe it will be that when the “window” opens, when the sky is rolled back, or parted, or divided, then all on earth will see Jesus seated on a throne at the right hand of God. All will know who he is. Every tongue will confess him. Imagine him standing up from that throne, and descending part way down, through that window in the sky, standing on the clouds of heaven!
And THEN, in the Sixth Seal, the trumpet will sound and angels will come to remove from earth and escort the saved in Christ – first those who are already dead, and then those who are alive and remain – to MEET JESUS IN THE AIR. Doesn’t this sound familiar? Because it is here:
16 For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a cry of command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the sound of the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we will always be with the Lord. [1Th 4:16-17 ESV].
Sixth Seal Summary -
So here is the point of the Sixth Seal. The warnings are all over. When it is opened, there will be no more atheists. Every eye has seen him. Every tongue will confess that JESUS CHRIST IS LORD – and this realization will scare them to death and in fear they will attempt to hide from him, to avoid him at any cost. At this time, the church is finally, victoriously, publicly raptured out. The planet and I do mean the entire planet, sort of goes into convulsions. Things will happen that are so inexplicable that everyone left on earth recognizes that time is up, that the church was right about God, and now that same God is unappeasably angry at all who remain on earth. That God they did not accept is about to "exact justice" from the Gentiles as he has spent the previous 2000 plus years exacting justice from Israel. At the end of this seal, the continents will not look the same. The landscapes will all have changed. The sky will not look the same. The constellations will be changed. All this will happen, and yet the earth and millions upon millions of lost people will still be here.
There is much in Revelation 6, and much in this summary that defies consensus. In an effort to build a little consensus, in order to persuade those who believe the church will be taken out of the world before the First Seal is opened, I think it is vitally important that we show how a Sixth Seal rapture is the only way we can get complete agreement between the events Jesus describes in Matthew 24 and the events John describes in Revelation 6. I think the best way, indeed the only way to make these two critically important descriptions of events match up logically and rationally and consistently is to put the rapture in verse 31 of Matthew 24 and immediately after verse 14 of Revelation 6.
Because this is so vital to our understanding of the remainder of Revelation, and to our understanding of end times events, we will take a step away from the Book of Revelation, and look at Matthew 24. In Matthew 24 Jesus’ disciples – not just the 12 but a group of his disciples – have followed him out to the Mount of Olives after leaving the Temple. These disciples heard Jesus say “2 …”You see all these, do you not? Truly, I say to you, there will not be left here one stone upon another that will not be thrown down." [Mat 24:2 ESV]. Jesus had predicted the destruction of the Temple. This sets the minds of his disciples racing. How can it possibly be that the house chosen by God as the place where He is to be worshiped will be torn down. As they continue from the Temple to the mountain, many questions present themselves. When they get where they’re going, away from the crowds that surrounded them all in the Temple, and things settle down, and there is time to consider, the disciples ask Jesus three questions. The rest of Matthew 24 gives us Jesus’ answers to those three questions. He answers them in order. He answers them one at a time. Here are the questions:
" 3 As he sat on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately, saying, "Tell us, when will these things be, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?" [Mat 24:3 ESV]…
Just to be sure we’re all on the same page, let’s pull those out:
1. When will these things be?
2. What will be the sign of your coming?
3. What will be the sign of the end of the age?
As a preview, Jesus answers the first question in Matt 24:1-14, the second in Matthew 24:15-30, and the third in Matthew 24:21.
Looking at that first question, they are asking when exactly the temple will be destroyed. In verses 1-14 Jesus tells them that after he is gone, there will be many claiming to be him, that there will be persecutions, betrayals, and love gone cold. There will be false prophets. Surely all these things occurred under the continued Roman oppression from the time Jesus ascended until the Temple fell in 70 AD. Nero was blaming Christians for the burning of Rome during this time. There was a continual succession of Emperors in Rome, each worse than the last, and Rome continued its foreign policy of world conquest – with wars and rumors of wars constantly circulated. As 70 AD got closer, in Jerusalem, the Jews began to turn on each other with some thinking loyalty to Rome was best, and others committed to pushing them out of Judea. Jesus encourages them, in 13 and 14 to remain faithful, to hold fast his teachings, and to proclaim him even in the midst of all this turmoil so that the whole world can know him. This is what happened as we see in Acts.
Beginning in vs 15, we get the second question. This is almost exactly the same question that the Thessalonians have asked Paul in 2 Thess 2:1-4. Look at how similar the two questions are answered. Jesus says, if I may paraphrase, that the sign of his coming will be the Abomination of Desolation standing in the Holy Place. When those to whom Jesus is speaking – on earth – see this obvious and unmistakable event – on earth – then Jesus’ return is imminent. In 2 Thessalonians, Paul says this: 3 Let no one deceive you in any way. For that day will not come, unless the rebellion comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of destruction, 4 who opposes and exalts himself against every so-called god or object of worship, so that he takes his seat in the temple of God, proclaiming himself to be God. [2Th 2:3-4 ESV]. Both Jesus and Paul say that this end of the world leader must appear, be recognized, and “take over” the Holy Place BEFORE the rapture occurs. Paul is very specific that he is speaking of an event that must happen before the rapture. REMEMBER, we saw at the opening of the first seal that events leading to the empowerment over all the world of this end time leader begin.
What kind of things will happen between the time the MoL appears and the rapture? We have already seen that there will be unprecedented tribulation. But look at the specifics – these are the things we have so often heard about, and yet many do not believe that these are information for the church to use during this time, and before the rapture: 16 then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains. ... 19 And alas for women who are pregnant and for those who are nursing infants in those days! ... 21 For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been from the beginning of the world until now, no, and never will be. ... 24 For false christs and false prophets will arise and perform great signs and wonders, so as to lead astray, if possible, even the elect. 25 See, I have told you beforehand. ... 27 For as the lightning comes from the east and shines as far as the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man. [Mat 24:9, 16, 19, 21, 24-25, 27 ESV]
((2024 - So I have said previously in these notes that we do not "see" the MoL in the first six seals. However, based on the paragraph above, we KNOW he will be there. If the rapture is at the sixth seal, then the MoL must have appeared, been recognized by the church, and proclaimed himself god above all gods, and the object of worldwide worship. All this before the rapture. Add to this that "he will make a treaty with many", but will break it. I see the breaking of this treaty with the Jews as the "light bulb coming on" so that we understand finally that this great world leader is in fact the MoL and is not about saving the world but about ruling over it with the power of Satan to back him. Now, if everything is to fit, and if the rapture is during the sixth seal, then the covenant between the MoL and Israel is broken in or before the sixth seal, and that makes the sixth seal the halfway point - more or less - of the seventieth week. KNOWING THIS, as we move further into Revelations, and we read about things the MoL does, we will be able to nail down the time. To do this, I think we will have to let go of the notion that Revelation is chronological from Chapter 5 on and understand it as observation from various perspectives, various locations, various "states". Sometimes, as in Rev 6, we are being told what John actually sees. In other chapters, it is not real events but a vision that is being described. POV needs to be kept firmly in mind as we move on into the meat of end time events.))
Once we see this sign, the Abomination of Desolation, we know that Jesus' coming - that is the rapture of the church - is imminent…but it is not quite yet. Jesus instructs us to flee for our lives. These will be desperate times for those in good health but infinitely worse for the pregnant and infirm. MoL will not be holding back. He will demand the capture and murder of anyone and everyone claiming to be a Christian or accused of being a Christian. His false prophet, and the image of the beast will perform signs and deceive even those who are elect - referring to both those who ARE saved and see these things and to those who are yet to be saved during the remainder of the tribulation. The martyrs of the Fifth Seal are also killed during this time. But make no mistake...the genuine appearance of the Son of Man to collect his own will be obvious for all to see. Here is the reason for the book of Revelation. It is written to believers so that we can "follow along" with end time events, and recognize just how close we are to the rapture.
Also, in this section, we find this verse: 22 And if those days had not been cut short, no human being would be saved. But for the sake of the elect those days will be cut short. [Mat 24:22 ESV]. Now think about this. The implication is that when the MoL goes into action in Matt 24:15 and 2Thess2, he is going to do all he can to wipe out the church, and he is willing to wipe out the totality of mankind – of God’s entire creation in fact – to get that done. This verse does NOT say that God stops him so MANKIND can survive, but that he is stopped so the ELECT will survive. The only way for this verse to make sense if the rapture has already occurred is to say that it refers to elect who will be saved during Great Tribulation – the last 3 ½ years. That would mean that it is referencing almost exclusively the Jews. I submit that it makes far more sense to understand this verse as referencing the remaining elect, including the martyrs of the Fifth Seal that we talked about earlier, who must complete their roles in the church before THE CHURCH is removed once and for all. This surely makes the most sense!
And the third question…a little more difficult. What age are they asking about? The Old Covenant Age? Doubtful because neither of the other questions was about that. The end of the planet? Maybe…but if we know what Revelation says we know when that happens. We don’t need any sign and there is no specific sign for that. It just occurs in sequence with other known events in that time. So that leaves the end of the Church Age, or the Age of the Gentiles – same Age, different names. This works If we believe the Church Age started on the Day of Pentecost and that it will end at the rapture. Therefore, in vs 31 Jesus describes the rapture in some detail because the rapture is the sign for all to see that the Church Age has come to an end as it is taken out of the world miraculously at the rapture. The rapture is the sign of the end of the age. Imagine all the people who will disappear, but even more profound – more undeniable – will be all those graves in the cemeteries laid open from the inside.
Interpreted this way, we see that the first fourteen verses of Matthew 24 have nothing at all to do with the End Times, and so trying to correlate any of the Seal Judgments with those events runs quickly into problems of consistency. We see that verses 15-30 describe events that begin when the MoL declares himself god and end at the rapture. Paul confirms this interpretation to the Thessalonians. We must also ask at this point exactly why Jesus would tell these disciples – these that are part of his inner council – about all these things if they, as the church, would NOT be going through it. You have to remember that Jesus says elsewhere that even he does not know when he is coming back. Therefore, his answer to these people must presume the possibility that THEY will see the Abomination of Desolation, that THEY will go through a great tribulation like the world has never seen, and that THEY will be taken up into the air without tasting death. HOW ELSE could they understand what he is saying??? What other interpretation works so well for both Revelation 6 and Matthew 24 is even possible?